ProDev: The Series – Complexities of Roasting

ProDev: The Series – Complexities of Roasting


– Yeah, welcome to ProDev. We have a ProDev series
which we do once a quarter, and we kind of try
to pick a topic that we’re really interested,
or we think other people are interested in, or we
think just needs to be maybe, explored a
little more thoroughly. So, it’s a great way for us
to push our own potential and to kinda keep
creating content, but kinda to keep
exploring new things. This quarter we’re gonna do
the Complexities of Roasting. So we’re gonna cover the basics, the intricacies, and
the complexities. Not a roasting tutorial,
so not really a how-to, but a like, “oh,
wow!” kind of ProDev. We’ve split it up into
three different stages, or three different phases. Phase one is the
charging or drying phase. During this phase,
free moisture is being driven off of the coffee
and then thermal energy is beginning to be
imparted to the coffee. So moisture that’s trapped
in that cellular structure of the coffee is
rising in temperature, the pressure is building
up and all of that kind of leads up to initiating
first crack. All of these things together can be described as
thermal momentum. There’s no significant
chemical reactions occurring as of
yet, but everything that kind of happens
here lays the base and framework and the foundation
for the rest of the roast. Matching the time
between dropping coffee into the roaster and
beginning of yellowing between batches
of the same coffee is critical in
achieving consistency. So if your time is too
short, your roast can proceed too quickly and
may result in scorching. If your time is too long there
may not be enough pressure built up to carry the
coffee into first crack. Once a desirable drying
time has been established for a given roast
curve, negative effects can be easily perceived
towards the end of the roast. A little bit easier. So, too much heat early
on decreases drying time which then decreases
the time available later in the roast for
proper development. And then that can result
in off-spec flavors. Phase two. Is the Maillard Reaction. The Maillard Phase. The beginning of
chemical reactions, namely the Maillard
Reaction, is represented by the yellowing of
coffee and the presence of bread-like aromas
instead of hay-like aromas. It technically
continues until a coffee is dropped and
sufficiently cooled. Or there are no more compounds available to keep
that reaction going. But we’re gonna kinda
consider it a distinct and separate section from what
happens after first crack. The Maillard Reaction is one
of the most chemically complex reactions that occurs
during roasting, more than doubling the
amount of aromatic compounds that are found in that coffee,
relative to it’s green state. It’s a form of
non-enzymatic browning which is typically
perceived rapidly from like, 280 degrees to around
330 degrees Fahrenheit. And it’s a chemical
reaction between amino acids and reducing sugars, that gives browned food it’s
distinctive flavor. There are vast array of
compounds that are created during this phase, but the
most notable are melanoidins. They primarily effect
flavor, body, texture. They had a higher
molecular weight, which leads to having a heavier
perception of mouth feel. So this reaction, along
with caramelization, is responsible for the browning that occurs in the
roasting process. They’re two distinct processes
but to our naked eye, they’re relatively the same. Phase three is development. Transition to this section
of the roast is denoted by coffee entering first crack, which signifies the beginning
of sugar caramelization. The caramelization
is responsible for a
build up water vapor and CO2 gas which
eventually leads to physical fracturing
of first crack. The Maillard Reaction still
occurring, like we said, but it’s now reacting
with different compounds. The reactants are created
by a sucrose caramelization, organic acid degradation,
and pyrolysis You may wonder, Hey
Kristina, oh sorry, how does roasting effect flavor? Great question. The flavor of coffee is
most drastically manipulated from the type from the
type of first crack through the end of the roast. And this is what we refer
to as development time. So both the Maillard Reaction
and sugar caramelization are happening
during this section until the roast is dropped
into the cooling tray. In general, shorter
development times lead to less cooked
flavored, you can say. So a lot more fruits,
citrus, bright crisper notes. And then the longer
the development time, the most cooked the
flavors will be. So, leaning towards
what you could perceive as heavier or darker flavors,
a lot more chocolate notes, molasses, maybe even tobacco. So an example of this
in real life could be, the same coffee roasted
three different ways. So if you had a Guatemalan
coffee, it’s base line, which would be like
it’s ideal roast, could have some sweet nuts, perfume florals,
spice, molasses. A shorter development
time would bring out more sweet citrus,
white tea, lime notes. And then a longer
development time would be more baked fruits, maybe
like mulled spices, again tobacco, vanilla, honeys, the things that are more
perceived as heavier or darker. Let’s taste some coffee. (muffled talking and laughter) – [RJ] The reason for
that is that a lot of that crust comes
from carbon dioxide. – Tea, ish. Not really. – [Woman] Yeah. – Peanut, like, shells. – [Man] You sure? – [Woman] 12 is such
a (muffled speaking) (laughter) (muffled speaking) (laughter) – I just don’t know. (laughter) (muffled speaking) – What does it taste of? (laughter) – That’s a good one. (muffled speaking) – [Man] That is excellent. – [Woman] 11. – [Man] 11. – [Woman #2] Sweet spot, 11. – So this is a very
relative process, but this is like relative to
our production roast lengths. – Because if you let
it go one more minute, it adds such a different
taste than that minute before. Right? – Nail down what you’re doing
for this part of the roast, flavor differences are much
perceptible than the end roast. So all of this part
matters, this part matters, but where like, the real
flavor can impact differences will be after you kind of
set these as variables. So just like you’ve probably
learned with Kristina, there are six major
variables that effect the brewing process, similarly, there’s major variables
that effect roasting. And we’re gonna talk
about five key factors and then a couple side factors. So, one, batch size. How much coffee you’re
putting into the roaster makes a big difference in
hour you’re gonna roast it. Just like if you’re
cooking a one pound roast versus a two pound roast. You gotta know that, you
have to think about it. If you are cooking
more coffee at once, you’re probably gonna charge it into a slightly
hotter environment. Just keep in mind how
it carries momentum. You might, you know, pull
back your heat differently to compensate for it just being a bigger mass with
more momentum. Factor two is density. So the coffee itself,
how dense is it? A denser material
has more efficient heat transfer from like,
molecule to molecule. So it’s gonna effect
what you’re doing. A coffee that’s grown
at a higher elevation typically is denser and a
lower elevation is less dense. Processing can also
effect density. So, you’re just gonna wanna
kinda plan according to that. It’s something that
you can measure before you start roasting
or it’s something that you can kind of dial
in from where you start. Third factor would be airflow. So, this kind of
operates in two ways. There’s airflow from how fast you’re spinning the
drum, so your RPM. Faster would be
a higher airflow, just kinda pulling
more air through. And a lower RPM would be
slightly less airflow. Key to that is that if
it’s spinning too fast, you can have centrifugal force
pushing beans against the outer wall and maybe getting
scorched through that process. And if it’s going too
slow the beans can kinda end up sitting there
and burning that way. So you wanna make sure
that’s operating correctly. The other factor for
airflow is your fan speed, so how much air is being pushed through the coffee,
throughout the process. If you’re adjusting that midway
through or whether you keep it as like, a variable
constant throughout. More airflow can kind of yield, like, potentially
different flavors, like potentially crisper
acidity or drier. So, something to think about. A fourth major factor
is heat distribution. So, how hot is the roaster
at any given point? How fast is the coffee going, like how much momentum
is it carrying? So with this we talk
about rate of rise. How many degrees per minute
is it moving forward. And you know, that
relates closely to time distribution but
it isn’t the same thing. And you can have something
that takes, you know, it gets to a
certain temperature, but how does it get
to that temperature? And that’s kind of
important at every stage. So, how hot do you charge it, when you first put
it into the roaster, how hot is the environment? How hot is it while it’s drying, how hot is it during yellowing, and then how hot
is it and how fast is it moving during
the development phase? And kind of interlocking with
that is time distribution. So these things are
very closely related but they’re not
exactly the same. You could time
out all the phases to take the same amount of time and potentially be
distributing the heat and time slightly differently. So just how long are you
drying the coffee for? You know, how long
is it yellowing for, how long is it developing for? What’s the total cook time? So, then these are the
essential elements, but a couple other
things you’d wanna think about before you start
roasting a particular coffee, or during the roasting
process, are moisture. So we’ve talked a lot about how the first part is
drying that moisture out and how crack is kind
of propelled by what
moisture is left, kinda getting to a boiling
point and exploding. So how much moisture
is there to begin with, is something you’re gonna
have to think about. Because it’s gonna affect the
way things happen throughout. How long the coffee
needs to dry, if the coffee is
drier it might be more likely to get scorched,
if it has more moisture it might be more
likely to lose momentum after it explodes from, you
know, it’s moisture heating up, so it’s definitely an
important factor, too. And then the last thing you’d
always wanna think about is just experience
and resources. So, me roasting the coffee. How well do I know the coffee, how well do I know the machine, what’s the environment
like around here. And that’s like really
always gonna matter. So these are the key variables, but those also really affect
kinda what’s going on. And then the other, which
Kristina will talk about, is what’s it being roasted
on, what’s the machine like? She’ll kinda take
us through that. – Awesome. So we talked about the
science behind roasting, we talked about some
essential elements, we compare these also to give
a little side note to like, the brewing essential
elements that we spoke about, and how there are always things that you can
manipulate and control. One of the obvious
variables that I think people think about when
it comes to roasting is the equipment
that you’re using. This is one other variable,
but it’s a huge variable. Before we start
talking about roasters, we can talk about the kind of heat transfer that
they all allow. So, before we talk roasters we have three kind of
main transfers of heat. Conduction, convection,
and then radiation. Conduction is gonna
be the transfer of heat through physical touch, convection is gonna
be the flow of heat through some sort of
bulk movement of medium, and then radiation
is kind of also that transfer of heat without
the need for a medium. So if you’re thinking
of the difference mainly between conduction
and convection, which is what we’ll talk
about with roasting, it’s the difference between
the transfer of heat from touch versus the flow of heat
from one thing to another. These are all the roasters
that we use at Counter Culture, so we’re gonna talk mainly
about drum roasters, and then we’re also gonna
talk about the Loring because that’s what we roast on. Drum roasters are the
most widely used form. Generally they’re
more economical. It’s a pretty
relatively simple design as in it’s a rotating
cylindrical drum that applies heat either
directly under the drum or through the center
through a conduit or channel. The actual heat can come from
electric heating elements or little gas flame
underneath it. The heat is transferred
through conduction and convection and
temperature measurements are usually taken in two places. One measures the
flame temperature and then there’s another probe
that’s gonna measure your abient bean temperature
inside of that roaster. They work great. There’s a lot of variability
with drum roasters. The amount of heat, your
rotating speed of the drum are both factors that you as a
roaster can adjust and check. They offer a little bit more
customization and variability that allow you to tailor
to different green coffees. The Loring is a completely
different kind of roaster. In the smallest of nutshells,
hot air flows through a chamber delivering a homogenous
distribution of heat. In a slightly larger nutshell, heat is pulled off of
the burner by a fan, it’s forced into the inlet
of the drum, forced through a bed of beans, then it’s
pulled out by a return fan. That air goes back into
the burner and then it’s kind of a rinse and repeat,
and it’s a contained system. The drum itself is
stationary and instead there are paddles inside
that churn the beans around. This uses mostly convection. It assures much more
uniformity with your roasts, since it’s not touching
anything it’s kind of being heated the
same way throughout because there’s
no touch to touch and it’s just being kind of
surrounded the heat instead. Also the hot air
that passes through that chamber immediately
sweeps away any chaff that’s gonna come off the
beans into a separate chamber, unlike in a drum roasters
where they kind of tumble along with
the beans as they go. So, the Loring’s a little
bit more consistent, it’s lower emissions and
it’s a lower gas bill at the end of the day. But the two kind of main
ones that we talk about. So drum roasters, and
then the Loring which is kind of all unto itself, just a different roaster. Cool. We’re gonna have our
next activity break, which is gonna be
we’re gonna taste one coffee four different ways. So one thing to kind
of take note of, so we talked about
different roasters, we talked about why
they’re different and how they transfer
heat differently, and how that affects things but one thing we didn’t
really mention was, again, all of that
variables coming into play, and how long something takes and how quickly
something can happen. So, we tasted in the
beginning was like, oh, this, like,
natural progression and then immediately coffee and then development happens
really, really fast. These are within a pretty
small range of time, and we’ll see if we can taste a ton of differences with them. – Yeah, just jump in. Feel free to break
more than one. Once they’ve been broken,
they’re broken, but. (muffled speaking) Yup and just until
they’re all done, cause what you’re doing is
stopping the brewing process and we wanna do
that very uniformly. So, try to hit them all ASAP. So one think that, you know,
we’re asked sometimes, is like, how do you know when you’ve
roasted the coffee correctly. And we have kind of
like a few-fold process going on into evaluating that. One thing we do is look
at how the roast ran. So did we, like,
how long it took, how the heat was
distributed throughout, did it happen like we wanted? The second process is a light reflecting technology which on our coast is
called the ColorTrack. So that shines light on
the bed of ground coffee and gives us a number
that correlates with how dark or light it is. And then on the east coast
they have a technology called the Agtron that
does a very similar thing. So that’s giving you kind
of some numbers to work off. Then, the third kind of
way that we assess quality and whether we have
done our job correctly, is what we’re about to
do which is tasting. So, a number should never
dictate your entire process but your process should
dictate essentially a number that you can then use to
like, fact check yourself. So something that we
asked a lot about in west is how do we decide what
does on each roaster. We don’t slot coffee
onto roasters based on how we want it to taste, we hone our roasting process to, like, so you roast
something differently on each respective machine
to get it to taste the same. And that’s, so we kind
of like, reverse… reserve engineer that. And you can’t do the same
thing on every roaster and make it taste the same,
but you can get the same exact flavor profile off any roaster,
while tweaking your process. And one of the fun things
about Counter Culture is that we have a pretty
apprenticeship based, kind of home grown sort
of roasting program. So there’s no top
down legislation of
everybody does what. So when you taste a coffee
and you buy two bags of Counter Culture coffee,
on two different dates, they could have been
roasted by two people on two different machines, using
two different methodologies for how they approach
the roasting, and have them taste
exactly that same. And that’s something
that takes a lot of work. – [Man] Yes. – That’s a pride point. – This number represents what it is on the light
and dark scale? – That’s right. – And then this one
is just the time? – That’s the time
it took to roast. So you’ll see that it
doesn’t necessarily take a shorter amount of time
to roast a coffee lighter. Sometimes to get
a coffee lighter and have it still taste
good, you might even wanna roast it longer,
sometimes to keep, you know, to have a coffee stay
interesting when you’re taking it dark, you might want
to roast it faster. So how long you roast
a coffee for is not the same thing as what
roast level you roast it to. – So you would crank up
the heat like really, into like, blast it really fast? – Potentially. Like, with 46 I would
say that’s a coffee that we roast faster to
maintain more nuance, where as roasting
something really light but you still want
it to be developed and you still want it to
be any coffee any brew, that you could throw it
in the espresso hopper and it would still
extract correctly, you might wanna roast
it a little slower. So those are just
kind of independent,
but you know, again, like codependent
variables to think about. – Yeah. – And play around with
if you really wanna get your coffee to the perfect production roast level
for all of your customers. – It sounds so,
like, complicated. – Complex, right? – Yes. – Is that the word
you were looking for? – Yeah, complicated,
I’m sorry I’m sorry, I don’t mean to use
that word, but– – You should use that word. – It’s okay, that’s
an okay word for it. – It’s kind of a
nice spread too, cause we get asked in
Counter Culture, like, how do you know you
roasted a coffee perfectly, or how do you know
you roasted it well, like what are you looking for? What is your
philosophy on roasting. And even in this spectrum
where it’s pretty narrow and there’s not
crazy differences, everything is acceptable,
everything was kinda there was something to
like in everything cup. But we all are
like, oh, but that’s where the coffee
shined the most, and we got a lot of sweetness, we got a lot of interesting
flavors that we were like, oh that’s just,
it seemed the best and that’s kind of what we try, because you can roast a
coffee and get to that, like, dark developedness and then
it loses a little bit of what was, exactly what you said,
James, like shining about it. And it’s kind of the complexity
of the entire process is finding this little
spectrum of, like, perfection for what
that coffee can be. Cool. We got one more section
and then we’re wrapping up. – So, there’s more to
life than roasting. We’ve talked all about
roasting, but the fact is, like, quality ingredients
make a quality coffee. So you can’t roast
quality into coffee, just like you can’t, you know, brew a great coffee
out of something that was poorly roasted, we
can’t roast a great coffee out of something that
wasn’t well-sourced. So, like as you know,
coffee is a plant. Relationships with
farmers who grow coffee is a super important
part of our model, and that’s something that
can very much complicate or simplify the
roasting process. So, we have a long-term focus
on sustainable partnership and helping our
producing partners reach their full potential
and then in turn we make that commitment and we’re
able to roast same coffees year after year and
really get to know them. Like, I have coffees
that I’ve been roasting three years in a row,
tasting six years in a row. Similar to how we wanna
develop partnerships with, you know, our brewing partners. A huge part of that is just, you know, making
those commitments and working to everyone
increase quality. Because then we’re able to
roast high quality coffee, it’s definitely easier
to roast great coffee than bad coffee or you
know, mediocre coffee. And it actually makes
peoples lives better as well, so that is a huge part of
how to roast great coffee, is buy great coffee
and a huge part of how to buy great coffee
is invest in great coffee. So, you know, we have a lot
of great producing partners that we could go
on and on about, but just for the sake
of this, I’ll talk about the Gallardo’s, Jose and Aileen. They kind of sent a little
bag of coffee to Durham, you know, and we always will
sample roast any coffee that comes through the
door and send feedback. So their coffee wasn’t great, but the coffee department
saw a lot of potential there and they worked with that
family and that’s now, that is a Gesha
that’s gone on to win the United States
Barista Champion for the last two years running. And it’s probably the most
expensive coffee on our menu and it’s really
unbelievable to taste. It’s like, that’s the
coffee I showed my mom to have her realize
that coffee’s amazing and you know, more
than just her Folgers. (laughter) So that’s like really,
that’s a huge part of how to roast is to
kinda put thought as far back into the
chain as possible and then also making sure
that you’re, you know, partnering on this
side of the chain, teaching people how to brew
and kind of considering the surrounding factor because
I can roast great coffee but if you folks can’t
brew it well, you know, that’s kinda where
that quality ends. So that’s something you
always have to think about. This is our roasting team. This is ProDev. Any questions about
the roasting process? – What are other good
qualifications you have for someone to make
them become a roaster? – I think that if it were
me doing doing hiring, it’d be an open mind
and a good work ethic because sometimes roasting
can be glamorized in a way that, you know, leads people
to think that they’re gonna be standing there smelling,
you know it’s like the meme what my friends think I do,
like what I actually do. So you wanna just be
familiar with the realities, like you’re gonna be handling
a lot of green coffee, which is dusty, and
a lot of burlap, you’re gonna get all dirty. Like, I wouldn’t wear
this while roasting. So, you know, you kinda wanna
have, like, your work clothes and just be ready to
haul a lotta weight. Cause that’s a huge
part of what you do. And then, yeah, just
somebody with an open mind and who is excited to learn,
as always, as in any job. – I know it’s very very
complicated, but like, what are the, like most
common mistakes that the beginner roaster has in the
beginning when they’re learning. – That’s a good question. It really depends on
the coffee program what is considered a mistake and how easy it is
to make a mistake. At Counter Culture, we
have a strong culture of apprenticeship
and trial and error. So we don’t want roasters to be trained up on a heavily
rigid procedure, we want them to learn and
develop good sensory skills. And a good intuition built
out of doing the same thing over and over again and
developing gut instincts. So as part of that, we kind
of have a certain amount of breakage, like I hit the coffee
at the wrong roast level. We have pretty
intensive quality specs, so you know, a lot of the
mistake you would make is just, like, miss-proportioning
the heat, so putting it in
too hot or too cold and then the roast
either runs away on you or it really goes slowly. And then just even
choosing the wrong moment to let the coffee stop cooking. You know, as you saw, it
goes fast at the end there, so just you know, letting
it go a little bit too long and having it just
kinda lose some of that, you know, what makes it special. Or letting it go too soon and
having it not really fully be able to express yet
what makes it special. There’s really any number
of mistakes you could make and at Counter Culture we do
encourage a learning process that lets people
make those mistakes but minimizes the
risk in terms of, you know, how much
product is being lost, because that is people’s hard
work on the production side, and we don’t just
wanna waste coffee, but we do want people to
develop into autonomous kind of roasting thinkers
that can handle new situations and roast new coffees
without somebody needing to, you know, give them a
roast line to follow and give them really
specific directions. – How do you guys keep
it, like, so consistent, cause I know there’s a variable
between different roasters, when you have to make sure
you set the right temperature, but everyone’s mindset
is really different, even though you
train them right. So how do you keep it
consistent when you guys have switch in between
different roasters. Like, I feel like that’s,
like, almost impossible, right? Cause everyone’s mind
is working differently. Like, oh I think this coffee
is this, has this much density, so I’m gonna put it in
higher, you know, like — – Absolutely. – How do you, you know, justify
that to make it consistent? – That’s a good question. Really it’s a lot of, you
know, constant communication. Saying like, this
worked, tasting together, working as team is
really important. And then there’s a
certain amount of, tolerance from what a person
can taste the difference in. So we tasted things that have
slightly dramatic differences to make sure that
they were noticeable, but if you think about
the space from minute one to the next minute, but
that’s not necessarily like the variance you’d
be thinking of. Think about like, maybe
three seconds, five seconds. It can be within that you
don’t necessarily notice that something is different
and it might not even taste different or be different
on the ColorTrack. So, just a lot of
communication, guidance, one thing that’s really
important for it is retention. So our roasting teams
have very low turnover and we’re able to
actually cultivate experienced team members
that are there long-term and roast the same
coffees year after year. – You know, for your blends? Do you get the green beans and then mix it up together
and then blend all at once? Or you roast them first and
then combine them at the end? – That’s a good question
and it depends on what we’re trying to achieve. So for Hologram, we keep
those components separate and then blend them
once they’re roasted, because they have pretty
different densities and we wanna roast them
to a slightly different roast level and at their
roast level we wanna make sure that they’re pretty
close to each other so that the extraction
is really even. But with something like 46
as I was saying earlier, we wanna maintain
more dynamic flavors so we blend them green and
let that different density and different character
kind of create more dynamism in the end cup. Because we know they’re
all gonna get roasted completely since we’re
taking it to second crack. – I would think,
like, that blends, they’re just so much more
complex than single origins. And it just fascinates
me that, you know, they just sell them
at a retail level cheaper than single origins. And I know it’s
a seasonal thing, because single origins,
they’re a seasonality, but I think blends
itself, you’re doing like, multiple different green
beans and you can mix them, you gotta make sure
they’re consistent. To me I think that
it’s just like, amazing how complex
it is but like, people value it as a less price. I think that it’s so
much more complicated, (muffled speaking) – Yeah, I think
that’s a good point. It takes a lot of
thought from our coffee department as
to how to take coffees that are priced correctly for
blends and maximize quality but also make sure that the
coffee is going into blends are specifically are the ones
that can exhibit their best character, potentially at a
slightly darker roast level. Coffees that do have all
that sweetness in there that will come out best when they’re roasted a little longer. And there’s definitely like,
sometimes an expectation that blends will cost less, so you wanna think
about that with pricing. Coffee that costs less
isn’t necessarily less good, but definitely when you’re
constructing a menu, and this is something that
Katie works really hard on with the rest of the
coffee department. [ Katie Carguilo ] I would
say on the production side, the single origin coffees
do generally take more work. Like it’s more, it’s more lab
work to filter those through and it’s definitely more
work on the farm level when we’re thinking about
what we’re contracting when those producers are
making those coffees for us. So I think that is
the mindset for us, that translates to
the price discrepancy. But you’re absolutely right, that here we definitely
spend more energy and time on roasting blends, blending
them, QCing them, sometimes, like making sure
that we’re using the right recipe and
the right amount. And the single origins
just become, like, a little bit easier cause
it’s just all about, like, well, these are great
coffees, let’s just make sure that they’re expressing
their greatness. But on the origin side,
they take more work. We work very hard to
keep very consistent flavor profiles
throughout the year. We don’t want you
to notice a change just because components change. Like, we’re very transparent
about what components are going into the coffee,
but we also wanna sure that that’s a bumpy road,
that it’s a smooth one. Because those
coffees should offer that level of consistency. – As far as buying
green beans for blends, are they cheaper
than single origins? [KC] They are, but they’re most
often from the same partners that we buy single-origin
coffees from. So it’s just, like a
different cup score target. A little bit lower
than single origin and usually it can,
if it’s coming from a cooperative, for example, it’s usually representative
of more farmers’ coffees. Like a bigger amount of
coffees blended together, than a single-origin coffees, which might be like a
single-farm selection
or single day’s harvest where there’s a
lot of energy put into achieving that higher cup score. – So yeah, so we, when
we’re buying coffees from our partners, though, we always contract different
qualities for different prices. We never wanna be just, we don’t wanna be
buying coffee at market prices because it’s a non-sustainable
price for farmers. Even though maybe we
could like, get 46 from coffee that
we’re just buying from an importer’s warehouse, but we also don’t just
want to be coming to a farm or cooperative and only buying
the really high-quality stuff and then leaving
them with the rest of the stuff to sell,
to find a buyer for. We wanna be, like,
a bigger partner. (muffled speaking) – Well thank you very much. – Thanks guys. – Thank you so much for coming. – Thank you for roasting
some good coffees for us. (applause) – Thank you so much. Thank y’all for
brewing great coffee. (laughter) (muffled speaking) – Will do. – [Man] My favorite.

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